Fatherpain’s 2018 Type R

[fatherpain]

I'd been wanting to make another brake service post, as my initial attempt was kind of all over the place. Would like one that flows better and is a little more coherrent. Hopefully this will help anyone following, and make it easier for me next time, haha. Had to wait until maintenance was due again. Seems pad changes are needed every 22-25k miles or so.

Anyways, here goes nothing Gonna start with walkthrough redux for replacing the front pads:

Assuming everyone knows how to remove wheels (22mm socket and breaker bar) and raise their car safely, so won't cover that.

Tools needed for the front pads (this photo is a placeholder, will be updated):

• Breaker bar for 1/2" drive and 19mm socket
• Torque wrench capable of 103 ft-lbs
• Flare nut wrench 10mm
• Hammer
• Punches, starting and drift
• Wire brush
• Sandpaper - 80 grit
• Brake or contact cleaner or waterless wipes
• Anti seize
• Kroil or penetrant
• Paper towels
• Brake caliper spreader (optional)
• Drip pan
• Knee pad

Car raised and wheels removed and turned to provide space to work (using lift, so not chocked). Make sure the electric parking brake is OFF, if planning to do the rears also. The rotors are rusty because the car sat a couple months before the pad change.

Raise the hood, open the brake cylinder cap, then rest it on top, unengaged.

Disconnect the hard brake line on the backside of the caliper. A 10mm flare nut wrench is needed, otherwise fitting will round off. Passenger side shown here. **Update** @Dave B shared by removing (2) 12mm bolts that secure the brake line there is enough play to swing the caliper out of the way to replace pads (and rotors if needed). No need to undo this line after all, unless need to service the caliper. This will save time, expensive brake fluid, cut down on mess and keep leak points to a minimum. Thank you Dave for sharing this tip and others on the following post.

Pull the brake line out and let it hang. Fluid will drip, so have the catch pan ready. Brake fluid is nasty stuff, so be sure to wear nitrile gloves and wash it off promptly, if contacts your skin.

Use a starting punch to drive the (2) pins out.

Spray a little bit of penetrant to help loosen it up.

Switch to the drift punch to drive the pins the rest of the way.

Hold the brass colored spring clamp while pulling the pins, so it doesn't launch. Putting a little pressure on the spring will also make it easier for the pins to come out.

Pins removed. Be sure to note the orientation.

Pins and spring clip. These are re-usable.

Use the pads to compress the cylinder pistons. Note which pad has the wear indicator and it’s location. (It's the inner one

Compress the pistons in the other direction.

With the pistons compressed, the pads can be pulled out. First the outer...

Then the inner.

As previously mentioned, the inner pad has a wear indicator. It will scrape against the rotor and make noise if let it get that far. I'd advise against that. Can see I had a little bit of life left on these pads, but not much. These are Girodisc SS pads with roughly @22k miles with 8 track days. For comparison. The OEM pads wore worse at 21K miles with zero track days.

New Girodisc SS pads vs old.

Use a breaker bar with 19mm socket to loosen the bolts securing the caliper, starting with the lower one.

Then the top.

Remove both bolts by hand and maintain a good grip on the caliper so it doesn't fall.

Carefully lift off the Brembo caliper and set aside.

Place the caliper on some paper towels so the paint doesn't get scratched.

Clean the caliper with contact cleaner or brake cleaner applied to a paper towel. Found out later that waterless wipes work even better.

Under normal circumstances, can use a ratcheting spreader tool to fully compress the piston cylinders, so the new pads will fit when the caliper is back in place. Be aware brake fluid will ooze out while doing this. I suppose one could use their hands to compress, but this tool makes it super easy. Found this on Amazon.

Brembo front caliper cleaned and compressed... Ready to reinstall right? Whoa.. wait a minute, what's that imperfection on the lower piston dust boots?

What the heck? Doggone it!

Dust boot appears to have melted. Asked the guys on the CTR track group and they said this is common as the brakes see a lot of heat. It's just a dust boot seal, but my Honda nephew recommended rebuilding the caliper, in case the internal seals looked the same way…

 

[Dave B]

While I appreciate all your efforts in the write up, there is no need to open a brake line to change pads or rotors for that matter. There are 2 x 12 mm bolts that hold the flex brake line to the spindle on the opposite side from the caliper. One has been locktited into place. Remove both of these and you will have enough movement to allow the brake line to remain connected to the caliper and still move it out of the way to change rotors. No need to open the brake lines for potential bleeding issues. Should you want to bleed the brake, just use the 2 appropriate bleeders on the caliper.

Another couple of tricks.

1) When removing the pins, I find it much easier to remove the top one first (the first pin is always the more difficult whether it is top or bottom). I use the punch as well but when it gets stuck partway out, I grab the far end with a large pair of needle nose pliers and use a light hammer with repeated small hits to the center pivot of the pliers and this usually removes the pin easily. The second one comes out easily. I also find that when replacing the pins, that is it easier to replace the upper pin first as it a bit fiddly getting the lower pin to line up and requires that you press on the spring quite firmly.

2) When replacing the pads, use channel lock pliers to pull back the pad on one side only, (doesn't matter if it is the outer or inner pad). Then replace that pad BEFORE you try to pull back the other side. If the brake line is still connected, when you pull in one side, you will just push the pistons out on the other side. If the new brake pad is in place, there is no problem and you can move to the second side of the caliper and push in that pad with no issue. There is no need to use a pad spreader.

These tricks have worked like charms for me repeatedly and can make brake pad and even rotor changes quite easy. I change between street and track only pads for every track event. I keep an extra set of brake pins available but haven't needed to use them yet.

 

[fatherpain]

Thank you Dave B, didn’t realize the caliper could just be swung out of the way. I’ll edit the post, when time permits. This will save on time, mess, keep leak points to a minimum as you mentioned plus $$$ to replace the lost brake fluid.

While I appreciate all your efforts in the write up, there is no need to open a brake line to change pads or rotors for that matter. There are 2 x 12 mm bolts that hold the flex brake line to the spindle on the opposite side from the caliper. One has been locktited into place. Remove both of these and you will have enough movement to allow the brake line to remain connected to the caliper and still move it out of the way to change rotors. No need to open the brake lines for potential bleeding issues. Should you want to bleed the brake, just use the 2 appropriate bleeders on the caliper.

Another couple of tricks.

1) When removing the pins, I find it much easier to remove the top one first (the first pin is always the more difficult whether it is top or bottom). I use the punch as well but when it gets stuck partway out, I grab the far end with a large pair of needle nose pliers and use a light hammer with repeated small hits to the center pivot of the pliers and this usually removes the pin easily. The second one comes out easily. I also find that when replacing the pins, that is it easier to replace the upper pin first as it a bit fiddly getting the lower pin to line up and requires that you press on the spring quite firmly.

2) When replacing the pads, use channel lock pliers to pull back the pad on one side only, (doesn't matter if it is the outer or inner pad). Then replace that pad BEFORE you try to pull back the other side. If the brake line is still connected, when you pull in one side, you will just push the pistons out on the other side. If the new brake pad is in place, there is no problem and you can move to the second side of the caliper and push in that pad with no issue. There is no need to use a pad spreader.

These tricks have worked like charms for me repeatedly and can make brake pad and even rotor changes quite easy. I change between street and track only pads for every track event. I keep an extra set of brake pins available but haven't needed to use them yet.

 

[fatherpain]

Showed the melted dust boots to my Honda nephew and he recommended a front caliper rebuild, in case the internal seals were in similar shape.

Checked with the CTR FB track group and several members answered with pix of their boots in much worse condition. Guessing these still may have been good. But figure it’s better to be safe than sorry and it presented a good excuse to figure out how to rebuild a Brembo front caliper.

Tools needed:

• Compressed air
• Air nozzle with tip that will fit inside the brake line port
• Small flat screwdriver
• Angled pick tool
• Block of wood

Hondapartsnow.com sells OEM rebuild kits for about $26 per caliper. It consists of new piston seals and dust boots.

The issue is going to happen again, as I’m gaining track experience and learning to brake later and harder. Will be looking for alternatives that can handle higher temps.

My machinist buddy Fred showed how to rebuild it. First take a small flat screwdriver and insert to where the dust boot contacts the housing. The dust boot has notches. Aim for one of those.

Then pry the screwdriver in this direction. The dust boot will pop out.

Grab it and gently pull away from the housing.

Then disengage from the piston groove.

Dust boot removed. I’d butchered it with my futile attempts before Fred showed me the way.

Use a small air nozzle with a tip small enough to fit inside the brake line port to blow compressed air into the brake line port. You’ll have the seal it some way so air doesn’t bleed back out. Anything will do.

This will force the pistons to come out. @MoodySara and @TriangleHeat emphasized these can come out with significant force and cause severe injury, so please use a block of wood to restrain the piston from launching when it pops, rather than hands and fingers as demonstrated here. Fred has an expert’s feel and feathered the air pressure and didn’t have a 100% input seal, but there’s always the chance something could’ve gone wrong.

Brake fluid will also come out when the piston pops, so nitrile gloves and safety glasses are recommended. Brake fluid is nasty so be sure to wash off if skin comes in contact.

If don’t have an air compressor, another way to remove pistons is to use brass wedges or another softer metal to pry it out. But the air method is much easier.

With the piston removed, use an angled pick tool to grab and lift the internal rubber seal.

Like this..

Remove seal and discard. Make sure no debris is left in the piston cylinder or any of the grooves.

Apply a small amount of brake fluid to the new seal. There should be enough residual from the old seal or the caliper to do it.

Insert the new seal to the internal groove.

Make sure it fully sits in there correctly. It should sit flat and not twisted or kinked.

Just like this. Perfect!

 

[fatherpain]

Apply some brake fluid to the dust boot, then press it on to the piston. Be sure it’s in the right orientation.

make sure the boot fully engages the groove piston.

The notches should point in this direction

Piston ready to re-install.

When installed, the outer lip of the dust boot will fit inside this outer groove. Make sure everything is clean and no dingleberries remain in the piston housing or grooves.

Carefully re-insert the piston with new dust boot.

Make sure it goes in square and not kinked to a side.

Press the piston in, then work the edge of the dust boot lip seal into the outer groove.

And press all the way in and all around.

Looks good! Repeat this process for each piston.

Brembo caliper rebuild complete. Only did the (2) pistons with the melted dust boots. Opted to leave the other (2) alone as they didn’t appear damaged. Ready to reinstall. A big thank you to my buddy Fred for showing me how it’s done

 

[fatherpain]

Wanted to measure the rotor thickness but my digital caliper battery died ?.
The 90F degree SoCal winter sun was beating me down, so I said forget it, ?.

Besides Girodisc says as long as the cooling slots are still there, the rotors are good.

If need to replace rotors, install tips can found here

Will apply some rust converter next time to address the unsightly rust on the edge of the rotors.

Inspect brake lines. The outer sleeve of this particular line was damaged after it rubbed against the inner barrel of the wheel back when I downsized to 18’s. Safety tip here.

The braided SST underneath is intact, so all good.

Brake line replacement and adjustment can be found here and here.

Anti-seize the caliper bolts.

As previously mentioned can use a spreader tool to compress the caliper.

Reinstall the caliper and bolting. Verify the rotor gaps are even it spins free without rubbing.

Then torque both bolts to 103 ft-lbs

Reconnect the brake line.

Then tighten with the 10mm flare nut wrench.

Apply some brake lube to the backing plates of the new pads. Though it won’t hurt anything, my buddy this is too much. Try using 1/3 of this amount.

Have had good experience with Girodisc SS pads, so going with them again. Not too expensive, good response and quiet.

Smear it evenly with your fingertip. Again this is probably a little too much.

The brake pads are not identical. One has a wear indicator on the underside..

And this pad is installed to the inner position, with the wear indicator side inserted first.

Then the other pad drops in. If only replacing pads, @Dave B shared some handy tips here, which I’ll try next time

Clean the dust from the spring clamp.

And use sandpaper to restore the brake pins back to shiny.

Then apply some anti-seize.

Reinstall the top pin, making sure it passes through both pads, the spring clamp and both holes of the caliper housing.

Press the spring clamp down to line it up, and insert the bottom pin.

Lightly tap both pins until they are fully inserted flush with the caliper. Be careful not to chip the paint.

Front brake pad change and caliper rebuild done. Verify the bleeders are closed.

Repeat for the other side, then it’s onto the rear pads followed by a brake bleed.

 

[fatherpain]

And that brings us back to the dreaded rear brake pad change. The final hurdle to this round of mods…Oh gawd.

It’s been just over (2) years since I took interest in working on the car and muffed my rear caliper….so was interesting approaching this task. A chance at redemption of sorts, haha.

Car is still raised and with electronic parking brake OFF.

Tools needed (this photo to be updated)

• Flat screwdriver
• Angled pick tool
• 7mm Allen hex socket
• Ratchet
• 10mm flare nut wrench
• Metal tooth brush
• Wind back tool - LH & RH + K2 head
• Autel AP200

Follow the Autel’s instructions to download the Autel and Diag-Asia App. Register and bind to your phone, and download the Honda library. Each Autel gets (1) lifetime library good for any make of your choosing. Additional libraries are available at 1 year subscriptions for $18.99 to $21.99. Rather than subscribing, I suggest buying extra Autels to pair permanently if wanting to use for additional cars.

The Autel doesn’t work with MoTeC, so had to switch back to OEM.

First turn the car to accessory ON (ignition ON, but engine OFF). Then reach under the steering column and plug the Autel to the ODB port. It should light green when connected.

The Autel will switch to blue when it is successfully communicating to the car, via your phone’s Bluetooth connection.

Open the Autel App. Click service.

This pop up should appear, allow.

S
Select EPB

Hit system selection.

Choose your region.

Pick hot functions.

Acknowledge this.

Touch brake maintenance mode.

Acknowledge this too.

Now the option to enter brake maintenance finally appears. Select it.

Verify the conditions are met then click OK. You will immediately hear the electronic parking brakes retract.

If brake fluid is low from doing the front brakes, the EPB will not work until the reservoir is refilled to a normal level and all diagnostic test codes (DTCs or CELs) are cleared and erased. Something I learned firsthand?

To eliminate hiccups, it’s probably better to replace the rear pads before the fronts, unless remember to top off, or swap pads without disconnecting brake lines. If leave brake lines connected, be ready to extract some fluid from the open reservoir so it doesn’t overflow when pistons are compressed to accept new pads.

This message will let you know you are now in rear brake maintenance mode. Click Ok.

Holy sweet bejeezus that’s lot of clicks. More than I remembered before, heh.

I believe at this point the car can be turned off. Took my sweet time figuring out the brakes and the battery completely drained and the car needed a jump to revive it. Was the able to reconnect the Autel to switch the EPB back to normal mode….

Or you can leave the car ON and be quick, which I plan to be next time.


****IMPORTANT**** under NO circumstances tell the Autel to return the EPB to normal mode unless the brake calipers and brake pads are fully reinstalled... otherwise the EPB will tell the piston to push to infinity with nothing to stop it and you will be screwed.

Here is proof of my mishap.

 

[fatherpain]

With the EPB in brake maintenance mode, it’s time to change rear pads.

Lift the hood and remove the brake fluid cap. You may need to use an extraction pump to remove brake fluid when compressing the cylinders to avoid spills.

Use a flat screwdriver to pry off this retaining clip

Like this and set aside.

Spray penetrating oil to the (2) bolts that secure the rear caliper.

Pry off the plastic caps that cover the Allen bolts that secure the caliper.

And also set aside.

Loosen the (2) bolts using a 7mm hex head Allen socket.

Use a 14mm flare nut wrench to loosen the brake line and have a drip pan ready. **This is optional**you may be able to compress the pistons with it still attached. I found easier to do it this way.

Brake line separated. Note there is a copper sealing washer that will fall off so don’t lose it. Best maintenance practice is to replace each time it’s disturbed, but reused mine. Living on the edge baby!

Back the Allen bolts out of the silver bracket, but don’t remove from the caliper.

Carefully lift and suspend the caliper. The electronic connector is still attached and needs to be disconnected.

It’s easier to access the EPB connector with the caliper free.

Insert an angled pick into this tab.

Then move in this direction to release the lock.

Then press connector off with your thumb.

Voila! Rear brake caliper removed.

Leaving the pads exposed.

 

[fatherpain]

The rear pads lift right off.

Girodisc “magic” pads new vs old @23k miles + (8) track days. Still had some life left….more than the fronts.

However the edges of one of the pads was deteriorating so the change was probably needed.

Apply brake lube to the backing plate. This is correct amount.

Smear it evenly.

Wire brush the pad holding prongs clean.

Install new pads with the pad that has the wear indicator inside. The same pad also has a spring gizmo attached.

Use some waterless wipes or brake cleaner to clean the caliper.

Rear caliper cleaned up ready to compress.

 

[fatherpain]

Note the 2 recesses on the silver piston. This is what the K2 head prongs will engage when it’s time to compress.

8 Mile sells a really nice caliper wind back tool on Amazon for $25 that includes left and right handed compresses, a strong back plate and K2 head.

These items specifically.

Start with the strong back plate, K2 head and either one of the compressing tools. It doesn’t matter which one. LH is pictured here. The only difference is the direction it rotates to squeeze the caliper piston. Both LH and RH are needed. I reached a limit on the number of rotations the piston can turn one way then it stopped and wouldn’t compress further. Switched to the other tool and it rotated the other way and finished the job.

Slide the strong back over the tool.

And attach the K2 head.

Fit the tool to the caliper with the K2 prongs mated to the slots on the piston face. Strong back plate positioned as shown. Spin the collar nut to take up any slop.

Then crank on it. Reminder, if attempting this with the brake line connected, don’t forget to keep an eye on the open reservoir fill as the fluid level will rise as its’s squeezed. Cabtstand spills.

Reached the maximum travel but the caliper wasn’t compressed enough to fit over the new pads. Switched to the RH tool and victory! The piston compressed the rest of the way.

Rear brake caliper fully compressed. Ready to go back on.

 

[fatherpain]

Apply anti-seize to the rear caliper bolts, then back them out so the thread is flush the housing.

Place the caliper back in position.

And get the bolts started by hand using just the 7mm hex socket.

Then use a ratchet to tighten. Found it interesting the caliper had some wobble despite both bolts being tightened. This remained so until the EPB was put back to normal mode and brakes pumped.

Snap the plastic caps back

Reconnect the EPB plug.

Reinstall the brake line and don’t forget the sealing washer. Will install new ones when pads are due again in 22-25k miles

Tighten with the 14mm flare.

Lastly, reinstall the spring rod. Repeat this process for the other side.

 

[BlueFalcon]

Great work as always, but I guess I'll be the one to start up the firestorm debate of what steps people deem unnecessary/necessary for pad replacement/general brake work-

Most people seem to simply pop the cap on the reservoir and press away on the pads. Worst case, if you're worried about abusing the ABS modulator, you could opt to crack open the bleeder screws when pressing with a hose and bottle collector (to avoid spraying your car/driveway/whatever) similar to bleeding the lines.

I've never seen anyone fully disassemble the rear lines when replacing the pads. You can pull the spring and bolts, then gently hang the caliper with line attached on a wire or rest it gently on the trailing arm or something.

I guess if someone berates me for not letting it bleed out when compressing the piston then I'll change my ways, but I don't see a reason otherwise.

 

[boosted180sx]

theres really no reason to remove the line if your main objective is just a pad swap for both front and rear. Just remove the bolts to the caliper and move it out of the way.
if your objective is to get fresh fluid in, its just much easier to just bleed the calipers from the bleeder till fresh fluid comes out.

i dislike removing the brake lines unless i have to. just creates more work than needed and possibility of bleeding issues to arise by having so much air to bleed out.

 

[fatherpain]

With the rear pads replaced, it’s time to exit brake maintenance mode, so it’s back to the Autel.

I’m probably skipping some screens, but the gist is you want to get back to hot functions

Click brake pad maintenance mode

Acknowledge this.

Choose back to normal mode

Confirm the EPB back to normal. You will hear it swap over once pressed.

Success. Now turn on the electronic parking brake so the car will not roll once the wheels are back on and the car is lowered to the ground.

All that remains is to perform a brake bleed, put the brake reservoir cap back on, reinstall the wheels, lower the car to the ground, torque the lug nuts to 94 ft-lbs and bed the brake pads.

The write ups for these can be found here:

• Brake Bleeding old school 2 person method, wheel torque and brake bedding procedure Post #23
• Brake bleeding (1) person method w/Speedi-bleed Post #476

——————————————————————-

The following additional steps are needed if the car is turned off while the EPB is still in brake maintenance mode. This involves clearing any DTCs the car sees when powered back on. One of the error codes would be that the EPB is in brake pad maintenance mode and it needs to be acknowledged and cleared before the Autel can put the EPB back to botal

Choose diagnostics

Select the Honda library

Confirm Honda, then run the diagnostic scan. Apologies I didn’t capture screen grabs of this but it is pretty straightforward

Read then erase the codes and confirm car is not running.

Confirm you wish to clear DTCs.

Turn ignition off

Then back on

DTCs erased

Now the option appears to return the EPB back to normal. Whew! All done.

This concludes my updated brake service write up. All that remains is to reinstall the wheels and torque to 94 Ft-lbs. Then bed the brakes (see below)

As has been mentioned, separating the brake lines from both the front and rear calipers isn’t needed so please skip these parts of the write up if just changing pads and rotors.... But the how to is there if needed

However they may need to be separated if using aftermarket brake lines. Pretty certain the Sakebomb SST lines are covering the caliper bolts, so they needed to be removed

Make sure everything is tight and in place. Reinstall the rubber caps. Wipe down any spills.

Reinstall the wheels, lower the car then torque lug nuts to 94 ft/lbs.

All that’s left is to bed the brake and pads. Here is Girodisc’s procedure. It’s probably similar for all pads and rotors.

 

[Dave B]

Agree that there is no need to disconnect a brake line. I use a Foxwell 510 elite tool (more expensive than the Autel but I think somewhat easier to use) to pull back the EPB. Then the piston compresses very easily with something like this. Lisle 24400 Disc Brake Pad Spreader, Brake Pads - Amazon Canada . The question I have always wondered about is lubricating the brake slider pins. I tend to do that but not sure if this is correct. I also find that with a ratchet head and 7 mm Allen socket that you can't remove the upper pins due to the OEM brake lines, so need to use a 7mm true Allen key. I find the job doesn't take all that long and leave the ignition on while doing both sides. I step on the brakes to pump them back up after each side but don't set the electronic tool back to normal until I have done both sides and pumped up both calipers.

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