Rough idle 2016 Touring

[elykoj]

so I posted before on this, where the car idles in drive at like 600 rpms and the whole car shakes. If I turn on the AC or the defrost it evens out and is smooth at around 700-750rpms. I have taken the car to the dealership twice about this since it started at around 20,000 miles. They stated it was operating at normal specs. They actually had a field tech state the same thing. I said this car didn't idle this low and shake the first 20,000 some miles. They said nothing they can do... it has 57,000 miles on it now and its driving me insane. I am tired of having to turn on the defrost or ac to have it be smooth. Has anyone found any fuel treatments or fuel injector treatments that have smoothed out the idle?? I have a hard time finding this is normal having the whole car shake like this..

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[zspeed]

Throttle body cleaning might help then disconnect and reconnect battery for the system to adjust and relearn.

 

[calonzo]

I have a hard time finding this is normal having the whole car shake like this..

Certainly not normal. Check Engine light has never come on?

Have you ever tried to disconnect the battery for 5 minutes to reset the engine computer?

 

[davidgostbo]

Certainly not normal. Check Engine light has never come on?

Have you ever tried to disconnect the battery for 5 minutes to reset the engine computer?

Definitely it is normal. Try idling your car when oil temp is normal you’ll get around 600 rpm and car shakes too without ac running. Not sure what your concerned about all cars do this.

 

[Gruber]

No, definitely not normal.
600 rpm is significantly below specification. But if the dealer service and some engineer said there is is nothing they can do, it's hard to argue. One thing that needs to be verified is whether it does it all the time every time, even after reconnecting the battery.
I would switch to a heavier oil if you're still using 0W20.

 

[gtman]

Actually...

For the older gen X models, idle was factory set an insanely low 630 rpms (once it's warmed up to normal operating temps). My car did the same thing and there are countless other threads on the same annoyance. Here's a couple such threads:

https://www.civicx.com/forum/threads/low-engine-idle.7320/
https://www.civicx.com/forum/threads/idle-rpm.2109/


I believe Honda did this as a gas saving measure.

Newer models now idle at about 100 rpm higher which smooths things out.

I know this from logging with my KTuner. Thankfully, I'm able to raise the idle rpm and now it idles considerably smoother. It was so ridiculous to have to turn on the climate control to keep my empty passenger seat from shaking badly.

 

[Gruber]

Actually...

For the early 2016-2017 coupes and sedans, idle is factory set an insanely low 630 rpms (once it's warmed up to normal operating temps). My car did the same thing and there are countless other threads on the same annoyance. Here's one such thread:

https://www.civicx.com/forum/threads/low-engine-idle.7320/

I believe Honda did this as a gas saving measure.

Newer models now idle at about 100 rpm higher which smooths things out.

I know this from logging with my KTuner. Thankfully, I'm able to raise the idle rpm and now it idles considerably smoother. It was so ridiculous to have to turn on the climate control to keep my empty passenger seat from shaking badly.

Has there been any confirmation from Honda that they did it on purpose?

Even if it was true, why wasn't the low idle rpm the case with the OP until 30 kmiles? It seems like the OP's case would have nothing to do with what Honda may have done on purpose with their new cars. Why would they do it only on coupe's and sedans?

If Honda hasn't confirmed they lowered the idle rpm on the initial years, I don't believe it. If new cars had low idle I would rather assume it was a glitch in tuning or something else.

The lower idle rpm, if indeed occurred in new cars, means to me either an error in production or a deviation from the service manual specs. In my judgement, the latter would be even more serious. Have they corrected the service manual idle specs at any time? Or the Honda civic service manual is "for entertainment purposes only."

It specifies the idle speed in neutral as:

670 to 770 rpm for 1.5T
700 to 800 rpm for 2.0
730 to 830 rpm for 2.0T

It also says clearly that this is regardless of electrical load. Whether high or no electrical load the rpm should still remain inside these ranges.

 

[gtman]

I am not giving you anything but actual hands on info from my own experience. Read the thread I linked and you'll find many others experiencing the same thing.

I know you enjoy dissecting things to the 'enth degree and that's your prerogative. Me, I only was stating the fact that my experience was identical to the OP in my '17 EX-L sedan and in the linked thread many others experienced the same common low idle/cabin vibration scenario with a warm engine in their cars.

Another thread on the low idle topic.

https://www.civicx.com/forum/threads/idle-rpm.2109/

Last but not least here are the idle settings on the Honda factory tune for my 2017 ECU:

ECT of course represents coolant temperature. Once it hits 171 degrees or above, it drops to 630 rpm as I stated earlier.

 

[Gruber]

I am not giving you anything but actual hands on info from my own experience. Read the thread I linked and you'll find many others experiencing the same thing.

I know you enjoy dissecting things to the 'enth degree and that's your prerogative. Me, I only was stating the fact that my experience was identical to the OP in my '17 EX-L sedan and in the linked thread many others experienced the same common low idle/cabin vibration scenario with a warm engine in the early 16-17 sedans/coupes.

Another thread on the same topic.

https://www.civicx.com/forum/threads/idle-rpm.2109/

Did I ever question that people experience it? Of course they do. Actually, I don't see where is any disagreement between us? I only said I don't believe Honda lowered the idle rpm on purpose.

The issue whether Honda did it on purpose (for mpg or whatever) or is it a glitch, has to do with the question how to fix it. Obviously Honda service says "it's normal" while it's not the common perception, and what's important, people want to fix it. Anyone had it from the beginning in a new car?

So it's not "dissecting" but an issue relevant to the OP. I see it as a glitch or a fault, and I don't understand why this opinion would be ever seen as controversial. People commonly tend to dismiss things as "irrelevant" or "dissecting" instead of admitting they might be wrong.

 

[gtman]

Did you look at the linked threads I posted or the specific idle screenshot I posted?

The reason (and this is "educated conjecture" on my part) that later models of the Civic X idle faster was Honda doing a faster idle that would speed up warmup and help with oil dilution. If you look at the A/C control (dilution) recall, part of the fix was an idle relearn procedure.

 

[calonzo]

Did you even look at the linked threads I posted or the specific idle screenshot I posted?

you look at the A/C control (dilution) recall, part of the fix was an idle relearn procedure.

So, asking the dealer to apply the oil dilution fix may fix the rough idle?

 

[gtman]

So, asking the dealer to apply the oil dilution fix may fix the rough idle?

If they do the idle relearn, possibly.

I raised my idle via KTuner. Vibration gone.

 

[Gruber]

It would be interesting to know whether the service manual ever had any revisions regarding the idle speed.

I'm slightly unsettled by the service saying it's normal, while it's out of the specified range. Unless they are saying "it will go out of spec as the engine gets older and nothing can be done about it."

Which doesn't mean they are not right. As the piston rings etc. get slightly worn, the engine internal friction decreases and the reduced idle load might cause the ECU to allow the rpm to drop, until a slight external load or a tuning fix compensates for it.

 

[Joe1986]

so I posted before on this, where the car idles in drive at like 600 rpms and the whole car shakes. If I turn on the AC or the defrost it evens out and is smooth at around 700-750rpms. I have taken the car to the dealership twice about this since it started at around 40,000 miles. They stated it was operating at normal specs. They actually had a field tech state the same thing. I said this car didn't idle this low and shake the first 30,000 some miles. They said nothing they can do... it has 55,000 miles on it now and its driving me insane. I am tired of having to turn on the defrost or ac to have it be smooth. Has anyone found any fuel treatments or fuel injector treatments that have smoothed out the idle?? I have a hard time finding this is normal having the whole car shake like this..

Sounds normal to me

 

[civicmanic]

It's normal. All my Honda's have done it.

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