Lacking Character - My (long) Si Review

Shralper

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"Way back" in 2003, my brother bought a new Focus. It was "only" a ZX3, but it did have a manual transmission. It wasn't very powerful, but it had a firm, yet comfortable ride. The handling was outstanding for an economy car at the time and it was very fun to drive. You could definitely tell it had European roots - if not for the blue ovals, you'd never know it was a Ford. It required more than its fair share of warranty repairs including an EVAP valve and interior A/C leak that required entire dash disassembly.
Time will tell how the ST will be as far as maintenance goes. I'll admit that most reliability ratings done on the overall Focus model have been pretty low (from what I read, the results are somewhat skewed due to early Sync infotainment issues). However, Honda reliability isn't quite what it used to be either. I also know that Car and Driver put 40,000 "hard miles" on their long term ST with only 1 small issue, so i figure I've got a good chance.

If it starts giving me a lot of problems before the warranty expires, I'll likely trade it in. Who knows? Maybe Honda will finally put the 2.0T in the Si by then? One can hope.
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CivicSi84

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Time will tell how the ST will be as far as maintenance goes. I'll admit that most reliability ratings done on the overall Focus model have been pretty low (from what I read, the results are somewhat skewed due to early Sync infotainment issues). However, Honda reliability isn't quite what it used to be either. I also know that Car and Driver put 40,000 "hard miles" on their long term ST with only 1 small issue, so i figure I've got a good chance.

If it starts giving me a lot of problems before the warranty expires, I'll likely trade it in. Who knows? Maybe Honda will finally put the 2.0T in the Si by then? One can hope.
The biggest thing dragging the Focus down is that shit powershift transmission they use on the standard cars.
 

Aero2001

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Having never driven the new Si, I don't know how I'll react to the power delivery, but I'll observe that other modern turbo cars have generated similar criticisms. Sometimes, in an effort to stave off turbo lag and provide better day-to-day drivability, the engines are made so linear that you don't get any high-rpm surge of acceleration, which seems to lack character. Also, turbos can muffle the exhaust sound, which can dull the excitement.
Quoting myself because I have now driven a new Si, and while I didn't push it hard, I thought the power delivery and throttle response were inconsistent. If I owned one, I'm sure I'd learn how to get the most out of the engine, and I did like it, but I wasn't blown away. My drive included a highway stretch and some nice winding roads around West Chester, PA.

As usual, I agree with Car & Driver, who said that sometimes the Si can't hide its tiny displacement, and for me this was at lower speeds in first and second gears. Once up to speed, however, I thought it was great, with nice surges of torque for merging and passing. And it felt great in third gear on the back roads. I also liked the engine sound across the board. But, also like Car & Driver, I think I need more time with the Si to form a clearer opinion of the engine and throttle response.

Not so with the chassis dynamics, which are outstanding as everyone says. I didn't notice a huge difference between normal and sport modes, but the smooth roads may have masked the difference. I preferred the steering in sport mode, and I found sport mode completely acceptable on the highway, FWIW. The steering is decent for electric assist, and definitely an upgrade from my 2G TSX. I was also impressed with the quiet highway ride, even on a noisy stretch of concrete pavement. That's quite an achievement considering the light weight and low price. I think it's quieter than my TSX.

I think the seats are fantastic. Just about perfect, actually. In general, the interior isn't as luxurious as my TSX, but that's to be expected at the price.

Overall, it's an excellent car, and if I had to replace my TSX today, I'd probably be choosing between the Si and the Focus ST. I'd prefer to stick with Honda, but the FoST seems to have more character, and in top trims it's more generously equipped too.
 

zx2down

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Quoting myself because I have now driven a new Si, and while I didn't push it hard, I thought the power delivery and throttle response were inconsistent. If I owned one, I'm sure I'd learn how to get the most out of the engine, and I did like it, but I wasn't blown away. My drive included a highway stretch and some nice winding roads around West Chester, PA.
Scott's Honda?
 


warrendeath

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I think if I can't get a Type R, I'd rather get the ST loaded. Way more options. Better performance than the Si. Great deals for them right now too.
 

Aero2001

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I think if I can't get a Type R, I'd rather get the ST loaded. Way more options. Better performance than the Si. Great deals for them right now too.
Yes, there are some amazing deals on the Focus ST. I saw a new ST3 advertised for about $27k around here, which is a phenomenal deal. It would be difficult to pass on something like that for an Si, even though the Si has some real advantages. I think I'd need to take long drives in both, back-to-back, to decide.
 

zroger73

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To each their own it course, but to me long-term reliability (even if projected) plays such a big role that I don't even want to test-drive the Ford...
In my neck of the woods, the majority of cars are Ford and GM models with many of those being pickups. You rarely see a Mercedes Benz or BMW around here - even the "rich people" drive Explorers and Tahoes. You see a fair number of Accords and CR-Vs, but Honda buyers are often viewed as "those people" around here. I'm the laughing stock of the town with my Ridgeline in a universe of lifted Chevrolets and Fords. My neighbor, who is the GM of the Honda dealer where I bought my current Ridgeline, just couldn't understand why I would buy such a thing. (He drives a lifted, full-size Chevrolet diesel pickup covered in light bars that he uses to pull his assortment of boats and jet-skis with. He wouldn't be caught dead in a Ridgeline.)

There are a number of reasons I've bought nothing but Hondas the last 10 years. First, they rarely, if ever, require any warranty repairs. Second, I trade vehicles often so resale value is very important to me. I've yet to find a brand better than Honda in this regard. Third, owning Hondas sets me apart from the average car buyer around here.

The last new Ford I purchased was in 1996 and I intend to keep it that way. I'm the sole decision-maker of my purchases and I have no investment in any brand. I'll continue to shop Honda first until or unless it becomes obvious that they are no longer the smartest choice.
 

Redglare

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[QUOTE="zroger73, post: 224114, member: 10618"buyer around here.]

The last new Ford I purchased was in 1996 and I intend to keep it that way. I'm the sole decision-maker of my purchases and I have no investment in any brand. I'll continue to shop Honda first until or unless it becomes obvious that they are no longer the smartest choice.[/QUOTE]

what happened in 1996 lol
 


zx2down

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4 Fords and never an issue I didn't cause by flogging the shit out of them. AKA getting air or modding it to the point the part was expected the break.
 

zroger73

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what happened in 1996 lol
I finally realized that the grass really is greener on the other side. :D

Actually, it just so happened that the next vehicle I bought after that new Ford in '96 was a new Buick in '99 (which, ironically, I kept longer than any other vehicle in my car-buying history). I was "curious" about Hondas in '99, but wasn't ready to "come out of the closet" until '06 when I bought my first new Honda - an Accord. After decades of owning nothing but Ford and GM products, this first Honda opened my eyes to a whole different world of ownership experience and value. My Si is my 8th new Honda in 10 years.
 

repeet

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I agree with Car & Driver, who said that sometimes the Si can't hide its tiny displacement,
I was driving today on a semi-winding country road with decent sized hills. I had my cruise control on and set to 59 mph. Cruising in 6th gear and turning about 2300 rpm. On the uphill grades, the car would slow down to 58 mph and then the turbo would start doing it's magic. Downhill on the other hand was less controlled. It doesn't have enough displacement at that rpm to hold the speed. On one hill it got up to 65 mph. If I had hit the brakes, it would have turned the cruise control off. And if I cruised in a lower gear, I wouldn't get the mileage. Minor aggravation where I live now. But if I still lived in southern California, where the down grades are miles long, you would have to downshift.
 

neteng101

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As usual, I agree with Car & Driver, who said that sometimes the Si can't hide its tiny displacement, and for me this was at lower speeds in first and second gears.
I wonder how different the reviews would be and test drives would feel if the drivers were given a Hondata flashed Si for the test drives/reviews. I'd estimate a guess that it would bring smiles and fix all the stupidity of Honda's stock lousy conservative Si tuning. Just budget a reflash/FlashPro and the whole equation of buying the Si can be changed considerably.
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